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	<title>Comments on: Heavy adoption questions</title>
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	<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/</link>
	<description>dawn friedman's blog</description>
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		<title>By: Dawn</title>
		<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/comment-page-2/#comment-23602</link>
		<dc:creator>Dawn</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 12:50:29 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thiswomanswork.com/?p=4455#comment-23602</guid>
		<description>Sassy, I really appreciate your input in this conversation. I hear Australia upheld a lot in reform circles but then I hear real life stories that make me wonder how it&#039;s ACTUALLY working.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Sassy, I really appreciate your input in this conversation. I hear Australia upheld a lot in reform circles but then I hear real life stories that make me wonder how it&#8217;s ACTUALLY working.</p>
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		<title>By: SassyCupcakes</title>
		<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/comment-page-2/#comment-23601</link>
		<dc:creator>SassyCupcakes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 12:46:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thiswomanswork.com/?p=4455#comment-23601</guid>
		<description>Now I&#039;ve calmed down a bit, I wanted to come back and thank you and your commenters for the great discussion that happens on this blog. Without it and other sites like it, I&#039;m really not sure where I&#039;d be. 

I also wanted to add that I think it&#039;s a good thing if the baby bonus means that people who would have otherwise made an adoption plan are able to parent and get through a temporary financial situation. But the other side of the coin, where people who are unable to care for their children are bribed by the Government to have a child or two that they otherwise would not have had really makes me queasy. Especially when I know from being a foster carer that many children who aren&#039;t safe in their homes are left there with little support for them or their families because we just don&#039;t have enough support services for people who don&#039;t know how to provide a safe place for their children. 

It also concerns me that adoption doesn&#039;t seem to be accessible (and definitely not socially acceptable) over here. I&#039;m concerned about how expectant parents are treated in hospitals here and I worry about the counseling and legal advice they receive. It&#039;s horrible that anyone is manipulated into placing a child, but I don&#039;t think it&#039;s any better when people aren&#039;t able to place an infant for adoption given that once they&#039;re over 6 months old adoption is not legally possible in this country (instead there are parenting orders which restrict the legal rights of those parenting child and the child itself). If I was faced with an unplanned pregnancy and no support I doubt I&#039;d be confident in making the decision make an adoption plan under our system and if I can&#039;t do it, how can I expect others to put their faith in us as PAPs when I know they probably aren&#039;t fully aware of what they&#039;ve agreed to (e.g. open adoptions that wont be enforced and that most PAPs here have no interest in.)

I also wanted to add to the demand discussion that there is a much larger demand here than there is supply but since adoption is pretty much inaccessible from both sides and the Government controls it all it stays stable. Instead of adopting here more and more people with money are going to India and buying babies over there through surrogacy programs. Personally I&#039;d prefer to see a lot more education about adoption, a lot more support for EPs, BPs &amp; APs, and the abolishment of Parenting Orders in favour of actual adoptions than have people bring home babies born in another country to a surrogate using donor gametes. That is just so fucked up when I&#039;m sure many of those families would be more than happy to adopt over here if it was accessible to them and they knew that their rights would be the same as other parents. Although, I do like that birth certificates aren&#039;t faked when POs are made, I really wish birth certificates could be amended to include the adoptive parents below those of the birth parents. I also wish that private adoption was an option for people in this country so children could be raised within families &amp; communities, again with the same legal rights as others.

I know I&#039;ve just gone off on another rant. Maybe we&#039;ll be disapproved of and I wont have to worry about this, but there is so much that doesn&#039;t sit right with me about adoption over here, and as I said before, I really don&#039;t like our adoptions being labeled progressive when adoptions as open as yours are not possible here.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Now I&#8217;ve calmed down a bit, I wanted to come back and thank you and your commenters for the great discussion that happens on this blog. Without it and other sites like it, I&#8217;m really not sure where I&#8217;d be. </p>
<p>I also wanted to add that I think it&#8217;s a good thing if the baby bonus means that people who would have otherwise made an adoption plan are able to parent and get through a temporary financial situation. But the other side of the coin, where people who are unable to care for their children are bribed by the Government to have a child or two that they otherwise would not have had really makes me queasy. Especially when I know from being a foster carer that many children who aren&#8217;t safe in their homes are left there with little support for them or their families because we just don&#8217;t have enough support services for people who don&#8217;t know how to provide a safe place for their children. </p>
<p>It also concerns me that adoption doesn&#8217;t seem to be accessible (and definitely not socially acceptable) over here. I&#8217;m concerned about how expectant parents are treated in hospitals here and I worry about the counseling and legal advice they receive. It&#8217;s horrible that anyone is manipulated into placing a child, but I don&#8217;t think it&#8217;s any better when people aren&#8217;t able to place an infant for adoption given that once they&#8217;re over 6 months old adoption is not legally possible in this country (instead there are parenting orders which restrict the legal rights of those parenting child and the child itself). If I was faced with an unplanned pregnancy and no support I doubt I&#8217;d be confident in making the decision make an adoption plan under our system and if I can&#8217;t do it, how can I expect others to put their faith in us as PAPs when I know they probably aren&#8217;t fully aware of what they&#8217;ve agreed to (e.g. open adoptions that wont be enforced and that most PAPs here have no interest in.)</p>
<p>I also wanted to add to the demand discussion that there is a much larger demand here than there is supply but since adoption is pretty much inaccessible from both sides and the Government controls it all it stays stable. Instead of adopting here more and more people with money are going to India and buying babies over there through surrogacy programs. Personally I&#8217;d prefer to see a lot more education about adoption, a lot more support for EPs, BPs &amp; APs, and the abolishment of Parenting Orders in favour of actual adoptions than have people bring home babies born in another country to a surrogate using donor gametes. That is just so fucked up when I&#8217;m sure many of those families would be more than happy to adopt over here if it was accessible to them and they knew that their rights would be the same as other parents. Although, I do like that birth certificates aren&#8217;t faked when POs are made, I really wish birth certificates could be amended to include the adoptive parents below those of the birth parents. I also wish that private adoption was an option for people in this country so children could be raised within families &amp; communities, again with the same legal rights as others.</p>
<p>I know I&#8217;ve just gone off on another rant. Maybe we&#8217;ll be disapproved of and I wont have to worry about this, but there is so much that doesn&#8217;t sit right with me about adoption over here, and as I said before, I really don&#8217;t like our adoptions being labeled progressive when adoptions as open as yours are not possible here.</p>
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		<title>By: SassyCupcakes</title>
		<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/comment-page-2/#comment-23594</link>
		<dc:creator>SassyCupcakes</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 14 Jan 2010 01:05:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thiswomanswork.com/?p=4455#comment-23594</guid>
		<description>As a PAP in Australia I&#039;d really like someone to explain to me why adoption in Australia is so wonderful and what progress has been made, because while I really like that the decision not to parent is made and finalised before there are any PAPs involved, I don&#039;t like the minimum of 3 months in foster care, it being illegal in some states for adoptive &amp; birth families to have independent contact even within an open adoption and the situation with permanent care for children over 1 and those with special needs.

I really don&#039;t feel that we&#039;re in a better position at all. I&#039;m glad that it&#039;s impossible for us to buy a baby. I&#039;m glad that open adoptions are encouraged. But the PAPs and even APs that I&#039;ve met have mostly been largely uneducated about adoption, desperate for a baby and only choosing local adoption because they can&#039;t afford more IVF or IA. There&#039;s basically no information available, questions are often not answered, even in applying there are significant problems and no guidelines in terms of what PAPs should look like. 

I&#039;m sorry to rant like this but I really don&#039;t like seeing Australian adoptions being held up as something to strive for when I have a lot of concerns that I mostly can&#039;t get answers to and I don&#039;t have the option of going to another agency. I also think it&#039;s worth noting that there are only a tiny number of domestic adoptions and while this is great in that it shows women all over the country aren&#039;t being pressured into placing their babies, I&#039;m amazed that any happen at all as adoption seems to be not only socially unacceptable over here but it also seems to be overly complicated and confusing for birth families with adoptions being delayed for months because of birth families moving on and losing contact with the Government agency without knowing that there are more things they need to do before their baby can be placed. 

I think it&#039;s also worth noting that since our government started paying out the Baby Bonus there has been a significant increase in the number of infants requiring intervention from child welfare workers. This is because people are having children for the sole reason of getting the money and people are make the decision not to abort / make an adoption plan because they see the money as a safety net, unfortunately it doesn&#039;t go far and when it runs out things get tough very quickly and too often (and not often enough) the kids end up in care. Given our shortage of foster families and social workers this often ends badly for the children and their families.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>As a PAP in Australia I&#8217;d really like someone to explain to me why adoption in Australia is so wonderful and what progress has been made, because while I really like that the decision not to parent is made and finalised before there are any PAPs involved, I don&#8217;t like the minimum of 3 months in foster care, it being illegal in some states for adoptive &amp; birth families to have independent contact even within an open adoption and the situation with permanent care for children over 1 and those with special needs.</p>
<p>I really don&#8217;t feel that we&#8217;re in a better position at all. I&#8217;m glad that it&#8217;s impossible for us to buy a baby. I&#8217;m glad that open adoptions are encouraged. But the PAPs and even APs that I&#8217;ve met have mostly been largely uneducated about adoption, desperate for a baby and only choosing local adoption because they can&#8217;t afford more IVF or IA. There&#8217;s basically no information available, questions are often not answered, even in applying there are significant problems and no guidelines in terms of what PAPs should look like. </p>
<p>I&#8217;m sorry to rant like this but I really don&#8217;t like seeing Australian adoptions being held up as something to strive for when I have a lot of concerns that I mostly can&#8217;t get answers to and I don&#8217;t have the option of going to another agency. I also think it&#8217;s worth noting that there are only a tiny number of domestic adoptions and while this is great in that it shows women all over the country aren&#8217;t being pressured into placing their babies, I&#8217;m amazed that any happen at all as adoption seems to be not only socially unacceptable over here but it also seems to be overly complicated and confusing for birth families with adoptions being delayed for months because of birth families moving on and losing contact with the Government agency without knowing that there are more things they need to do before their baby can be placed. </p>
<p>I think it&#8217;s also worth noting that since our government started paying out the Baby Bonus there has been a significant increase in the number of infants requiring intervention from child welfare workers. This is because people are having children for the sole reason of getting the money and people are make the decision not to abort / make an adoption plan because they see the money as a safety net, unfortunately it doesn&#8217;t go far and when it runs out things get tough very quickly and too often (and not often enough) the kids end up in care. Given our shortage of foster families and social workers this often ends badly for the children and their families.</p>
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		<title>By: a bunch of things, mostly adoption related &#171; the night kitchen: writing when i should be making dinner</title>
		<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/comment-page-2/#comment-23512</link>
		<dc:creator>a bunch of things, mostly adoption related &#171; the night kitchen: writing when i should be making dinner</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 07 Jan 2010 18:50:38 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thiswomanswork.com/?p=4455#comment-23512</guid>
		<description>[...] is often the case, there&#8217;s a great conversation/ debate going on over at dawn&#8217;s place . i didn&#8217;t have the energy to respond there in a timely manner, but i am very impressed with [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] is often the case, there&#8217;s a great conversation/ debate going on over at dawn&#8217;s place . i didn&#8217;t have the energy to respond there in a timely manner, but i am very impressed with [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Blame, entitlement and the adoption chasm &#171; Diarrhea of a madman</title>
		<link>http://www.thiswomanswork.com/2009/01/12/heavy-adoption-questions/comment-page-2/#comment-19040</link>
		<dc:creator>Blame, entitlement and the adoption chasm &#171; Diarrhea of a madman</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 16 Jan 2009 16:12:06 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.thiswomanswork.com/?p=4455#comment-19040</guid>
		<description>[...] entitlement and the adoption&#160;chasm  I am inspired by Dawn - or at least the commentary on this post of hers. I am not sure I can cover everything that is in [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] entitlement and the adoption&nbsp;chasm  I am inspired by Dawn &#8211; or at least the commentary on this post of hers. I am not sure I can cover everything that is in [...]</p>
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